Quality Grind Podcast Episode 8 – Managing Change

Jessica Taylor: [00:00:00] This is the Quality Grind Podcast presented by Medvacon. Conversations that go beyond compliance. Sharing insights geared toward helping you navigate the everyday grind of regulated life science industries. Here are your hosts, Joe Toscano and Mike Kent.

Mike Kent: Welcome back to The Grind, everyone. Mike and Joe here with you to talk about managing change today. We know that this is taking a big bite off of a huge apple, and there’s a lot of different directions that we could go with this. Because change happens to us, and we’re affected by change no matter where we work and no matter what environment we’re in.

So, Joe, how do we get started with this? And where do we want to take our discussion today?

Joe Toscano: Mike, thanks. And as you mentioned, change is a huge topic, right? It’s something that impacts everyone [00:01:00] on a daily basis, whether it’s personal change, change within your work environment. It’s something that everyone deals with on a regular basis.

And some of that change could be positive. Some of that change could have some different impact. And the reason we wanted to kind of have a discussion around it is, you know, as consultants and working with the number of companies that we do, our job and our role is really to bring about improvement and change to the organization that’s going to end up in an outcome that’s much better than what they had. And because of that change, it’s going to impact not only the company on how they do things, but more specifically people.

What I think would be interesting, and you and I talked about it before the show, is let’s talk about individuals and how they could help incorporate some of this change. And then let’s talk about individuals and how they’re impacted by change and how they could embrace that and really be successful with it.

Now, what’s really important here is we’re not going to talk specifically about a regulated environment today. We actually have a [00:02:00] second show where we’re going to bring on a guest who’s really an expert in that space to have that conversation with us. But today we wanted to speak more in general and in terms of simple things that people can do that can make big differences.

Mike Kent: Alot of the facets of change really are universal from a high level. How to make it successful, how to identify what needs to change, who’s involved, how to get them involved. Regardless of your environment, all of those things are important.

Joe Toscano: Absolutely, Mike. I mean, you know, the best place to start here is how individuals can really start to kind of foster some change, right? People are afraid to sometimes bring forward ideas or initiatives because they’re not sure that other individuals are going to take them seriously, listen to them, or quite frankly, sometimes they feel they’re in a position where they can’t actually make a difference. That’s so untrue, and we see it all the time.

We go into a client where [00:03:00] we sit with the team and the individuals that we’re working with, and it’s amazing the ideas that come forward, the processes, things they would like to implement, but they were never quite sure how to go about doing so.

The first thing is you really have to have some initiative in order to say, “Hey, look, I don’t like what I’m seeing. I don’t like how this is going, or I love what we’re doing, but I even think we could do it better.” And that first step is really recognition. What is it that can be done, needs to be changed?

And then start thinking about how can we do it, so that if I actually go have a conversation with somebody, what are those first things that I need to be able to express to them in order to start this process?

And again, you know, the biggest fallacy we see is, well, I’m not a manager. I’m not a director. I’m not a vice president. I’m not in a position to foster this. that’s not true. Anybody at

Mike Kent: Absolutely.

Joe Toscano: can make a change if they want to.

Mike Kent: And they really should. There’s a [00:04:00] lot of factors that go into that and how you cultivate and create that environment where people feel like they can bring those changes up. Whether it’s self-induced, or whether it is the environment, or just an assumption about the environment, I think there’s a lot of fear and resistance that comes from that. And, “What happens if my idea doesn’t work. I don’t want to look like a fool.” All of these things.

So, how do folks take that and be aware of, “All right, yeah, it may not work”, or, “it may not be a good idea,” or, “gee whiz, what if it does work? Now we’ve got to change things everywhere. There may be some extra work involved.” Those sorts of things. How do we acknowledge and then overcome that fear and resistance within ourselves as individuals when we do have that great idea?

Joe Toscano: The thing is, for individuals to come forward and do that first, the best people to do it are the people actually doing the work that you’re looking to have impact with, right?

Mike Kent: Very much so, [00:05:00] yes.

Joe Toscano: And, you know, they’re doing it day in day out. They’re seeing what’s impactful, what’s working, what’s not. And they usually have an idea. Many times people just do it themselves where they’ll implement something right where they think will improve the outcome that they’re trying to achieve, job performance, sales, marketing, whatever it may be.

But the next step is really to have the courage and share that with others. There’s very small steps that people can take. And we do this all the time. When we go in and consult for a company, it’s not a question of improving or just fixing an issue. It’s also a question of establishing a way that that could be brought forward in the future.

And really kind of the 1st step, and we’re going to be talking from a very high level today, is identify the problem. What is it that we’re looking or want to make a change with? What is the idea that we have that can improve a process or maybe fix an existing issue? Once that’s identified and some thought has gone into it, start having some conversations with [00:06:00] people you know and trust.

They could be co-workers, they could be your manager if you want to start at that level and have that relationship. But it’s a discussion. “I had an idea, I want to try it. What do you think?” Or even people outside the industry. “Hey, look, you know, this is kind of what I do. This is what I’m thinking. Does this make sense to you, or do you have a different perspective?” And get some validation so that you could even improve upon it further before we talk about the next step.

Mike Kent: They can help you understand what you’re looking to do from a lot of different perspectives. Things that you may not have thought of, being aware of assumptions that you’re making, or ways to go about it or what data or information or who else to talk to that may be useful. And that just accelerates the process and it also gives you a chance to practice pitching your idea.

Joe Toscano: I think what we run into a lot of times, and I mentioned it earlier, we’ll go into a meeting and it’s amazing the feedback we get back from those involved that we’re going to be working with. And [00:07:00] you say, “Well, you know what, that’s a good solution, or that’s a good approach, or did you try that, or did you have those discussions?” And many times what we’ll hear is, “Well, no, we weren’t sure if it would be accepted or heard, or I did try and it didn’t maybe work the way we had hoped,” and that’s okay.

What that means is that there needs to be a better procedure within an organization for somebody to maybe express themselves and bring some value to the company that they would have missed if that weren’t in place, or an environment wasn’t created where something like that could be brought forth. And it’s okay to explore that and have conversations, even if at the end of the day, nothing ever comes of it. The best thing that did come from it is the opportunity to talk about it, right? That might lead to a better solution down the road or another train of thought that wasn’t going to be gotten to without that initial discussion. Or if it does have merit, what kind of impact could it have?

 As you formulate that idea more so, then sit down with your manager and say, “Hey, look, you know, I was thinking [00:08:00] about this.” It’s great that you’re taking some initiative, right? So they’re going to recognize that. They can not only help you make that real, they could also enhance it because they may have a different level of experience than you do and can bring more to it than perhaps you had thought of.

Mike Kent: The initiative and the courage and all of that, I think is fueled by having a perspective of curiosity. Being curious about what could be is oftentimes a really big driver to help people overcome that initial barrier of, “I’m not really sure. Hey, I wonder what this could do or what this could be like?” At the very least, and you mentioned it, Joe, if you’re sitting down having that conversation with a manager, that manager now knows, boy, this is a person that is thinking outside the box, is looking for opportunities. And that’s a tremendous benefit, even if that idea goes over like a lead balloon afterwards, right?

Joe Toscano: Mike, you know, as well as I do, and we’re all guilty of it. Everybody that’s listening to this is guilty of it. And that is, [00:09:00] how often are you with people that are complaining about their work, their work environment, how things are done. I can’t believe the

Mike Kent: Never,

Joe Toscano: this

Mike Kent: never happens.

Joe Toscano: way? I wish they would do this instead. Right?

Mike Kent: Right. Yeah.

Joe Toscano: Everybody has those ideas. Everybody does. Or at the very least, the ability to see what they don’t like. You know, all we’re saying is, make a small change and do something about it. Again, there’s an appropriate way. There’s individuals that definitely would be interested in hearing and what you had to say.

But if everybody just complained about things, but nobody did anything about it, where does that get you? Everybody’s still unhappy about that situation, but you can’t always wait for somebody else to fix it. Now is everybody going to all of a sudden stand up and say, “Hey, I’m going to fix this problem.” No. But if you’re one of those people listening that’s been sitting on the fence, bring a solution forward, especially if it’s something that a lot of people are complaining about, or people are not happy with, and you have an idea for. [00:10:00] And you can’t always say it’s the manager’s responsibility. No, it’s really kind of everybody’s responsibility. But if everybody in the organization, no matter the level that you are at, can help bring things forward, then those people in those positions are the ones that are in the place in order to make those realities.

Mike Kent: I hear this an awful lot with people and they’ll say, the phrase is ‘there’s no such thing as a stupid question’. One question begets a second question, and then a third, and then all of a sudden you’ve got a group of people that are asking questions and being curious as opposed to what you said earlier about complaining and not doing anything and just accepting, well, we can’t do anything about this.

So in addition to taking that leap of faith and that little bit of courage, once you have that idea, how do you go about really getting that formulated and develop it a little bit and making that presentation to folks who would help you implement it?

Joe Toscano: Mike, you bring up a great question. You need to do a little work, right? You [00:11:00] have an idea, doesn’t mean that it may work. It would be best to test it out and see how that, again, plays with others. But is there data to support it? Are you seeing metrics or is there information that you can gather, things that you can do that brings validity and strength to what you’re looking to propose? All of a sudden you have something that’s much stronger and has a greater chance of success than not.

Mike Kent: It becomes less of an opinion and more of experience backed up by data and observation. It’s less a feeling and reaction. It comes across a little better. Is that kind of where you’re going with gathering that data and information?

Joe Toscano: Exactly. And let’s get something straight. You don’t have to have all the data when you first have a conversation,

Mike Kent: Yes, absolutely. Yep.

Joe Toscano: and you say, “Hey, look, I have this idea. Let me let me try it on you,” and you get by in. And most people say, “Well, have you thought of this? Did you look at that? Did you [00:12:00] substantiate it?” I could tell you if you sit down with your manager, it’s the first thing they’re gonna say is, well, how do you know this will work? I mean, it makes sense. But do you have

Mike Kent: Right.

Joe Toscano: it? there might be some things that there won’t be, but most things do. Most things can be pointed to another experience or information or a methodology that’s worked in the past that if utilized here that maybe isn’t will have the impact that you want.

But it’s always better if you could validate the idea in terms of showing proof that it’s worked, before or in other places, and there’s no reason that it can’t work here as well.

Mike Kent: And that is going to help you anticipate and address potential challenges to your idea or counter-ideas, and also give you a little bit more backing to say, “Yeah, I think this will work.”

And we’re all familiar with that person who walks into the office, they’re a brand new hire, they’ve been there for a couple of months. “Well, back in my previous life, we used to do, and it was the greatest thing since sliced bread.” [00:13:00] And what are the two reactions to that? It’s, “Okay, great, that worked in your environment, but here are the thousand reasons why it won’t work in our environment,” or, “well, that’s great, and, you know, eh, not so sure.”

There’s also a way to approach those and pitch those ideas of, “Well, here’s what we did last time.” Keep in mind that people are very attached to the way that they do things. Especially if you say that, “Well, in our last job, or my last job, this is how we did it,” and the person you’re saying that to actually designed and came up with the current process and now gets defensive about, “Well, why are you attacking something that I came up with and is working?”

And I realize I’m getting off on a little bit of a tangent, but I think it’s an important point to consider. When you are gathering your initial information and initial data, trying to [00:14:00] anticipate problems or challenges or concerns or barriers, what might come up or what that extra work might look like in order to implement it, be intentional about that. Do as best you can to engage people and get them curious about what could be as opposed to saying, “Well, this is the way that it should be because everything’s broken.” Style points, I guess is what I’m coming down to here. Style points kind of matter, don’t they?

Joe Toscano: Well, they do. And let’s talk about that person that loves to talk about how they used to do it somewhere else. You know, there’s really two sides to that. It’s either kind of used as a rub, which people don’t normally appreciate. But if you’re serious about it, then it’s really simple. Most of your work is already done for you. Look how that applies to your current situation. And if there’s changes that are necessary in order to implement it to get that same result from where you came from, then bring it forward. Then [00:15:00] that’s a very valid point.

But if it’s used just to complain because you want to just share that, “hey, this used to work really well over here and it’s not working here,” or “you guys don’t do this and you should be doing this,” that doesn’t solve any problems and doesn’t get anybody to an end point that they want.

The whole point of change is to really help people implement something that just makes everything better. And if something isn’t working correctly, to improve it so that it does and then could exceed that expectation. That’s always what the end result should be and how it should be measured. This is no different. Everybody has this capability. But if you have a great example from before, utilize it, but show how it works in the current environment. If you’re saying it to say, you’re better off not. Right, that’s not going

Mike Kent: Yeah,

Joe Toscano: help to anybody.

Mike Kent: Most often, critiques don’t engage the people you need to be on board to make that change or to adopt or adapt [00:16:00] to that change. So if you go about it from a, “Hey, have we thought about this? This may work, how could it work?” as opposed to it must, that’s a great way of of teeing those things up.

Joe Toscano: And there’s nothing wrong with bringing that previous experience. If you come from an organization that had a great process, Share. I mean, as long as you’re not breaking any rules or confidentiality. You always have to be mindful of those things, right? Or a proprietary process that shouldn’t be shared. You know, let’s get those caveats out of the way. If the information is appropriate and can be utilized and there’s a way to go about it, and you can share that best practice and implement it to the current situation, that is a huge win for everybody.

And you know, you should use that experience. The reason people get promotions and grow in their jobs is because of their experience, right? So this is

Mike Kent: Right.

Joe Toscano: no different. It’s just used in a very different way.

Mike Kent: Very much so. [00:17:00] The diversity of that thought and bringing in those new ideas is sometimes why individuals get hired in the first place, right, is to mix things up or to look for different ideas. And that’s all part of crafting a persuasive presentation and being able to engage people and gain acceptance.

And, well, let’s put it a different way. Maybe it means building some allies for this change that really needs to happen. Instead of saying, “We need to do x, y, and z”, framing that a little bit differently, as a question about, “Have we ever thought about x, y, and z?”

Joe Toscano: You know, Mike, I think, it comes back to what we said before. It’s just having some comfort in having a conversation, right?

 If you have an idea, because we all do, share that with some people. If they get excited about what you’re talking about, do a little research and see if you could back it up a bit. And if you can, that’s wonderful. Take it to [00:18:00] the next step. Have that conversation with your manager. Because what you might find is you’re on to something that’s much bigger than what you thought. Even if it’s just for your team, all of a sudden, you just made everybody’s life a lot better/easier because you fixed a process or an approach or had a good idea that gets now to an outcome that they really want.

So I think from an individual perspective, if people can take those simple steps, and the biggest one is just have a little bit of courage to start it, it’s amazing what could happen. And even if it doesn’t work, and even if it doesn’t go anywhere, it still has a tremendous positive impact because it may spur other ideas that didn’t exist before. And it shows initiative, and that’s what people want to see, right? That’s how individuals are measured. What have you done? It’s not just job performance, but if you could bring value beyond the job performance, well, there’s a lot more recognition that comes with that and greater growth.

So there’s no downside to being proactive. What we see over and over again is people have great [00:19:00] ideas. It’s such a shame. Sometimes they don’t bring them forward or know how to really take that initial step to start the conversation. And that’s all we’re trying to get to – start the conversation.

Mike Kent: Yeah, and as you said before, once that conversation gets started, you’ll begin to gather information, you’ll begin to gather data, you’ll begin to understand better what needs to happen in order to potentially implement the change or to get it approved, who you need to talk to, etc. So this is a constant growth once you’ve started and lit that flame on the process.

So Joe, what about the situation where you’ve got an idea, and maybe ideas in your particular work environment aren’t really well received, or there doesn’t seem to be an environment which is change friendly. What should people do in that situation and are there ways to try and avoid that?

Joe Toscano: We see that a lot as we go into organizations and have conversations. [00:20:00] We hear, “You know, we suggested this,” or, “we talked about this. We have identified this, but unfortunately it never went forward.” And sometimes, unfortunately, that is a failure on the leadership side not to recognize those opportunities.

The best place that could start is within your team and with your direct leadership and having those conversations. It’s a group of employees sitting down informally with their manager and saying, “Hey, look, we’ve all been talking about this. We think this is worth exploring. It’s something that we believe has merit, what are your thoughts? What do you think? We want you involved. If this is something, we all win from it.”

Because again, positive change impacts everybody in a positive way, like negative change impacts everybody in a negative way. With that, we’re in on the positive side of things, right?

So, yep, at the of the day, sometimes there are failures, and we’ve talked a little bit about that in our leadership episode, but they’re easily overcome. And again, it goes through communication. If individuals are open to having those discussions. There’s more strength with a [00:21:00] couple of people coming forward from a team and having that discussion, expressing how important something may be and why it should be implemented or move forward.

And from the leadership side, it’s also a very easy fix. Let the culture of the company be that if somebody comes forward with a proposal, an idea, suggestion, they went through a lot of trouble to come up with it, identify it, and it’s only for the good of the organization. But it’s got to be built into the culture for people to be willing to listen and want to move forward with it.

Mike Kent: Yeah, and unfortunately it just takes one idea that gets shot down immediately without an explanation to shut down an entire culture. But it also takes just one, “Well, let’s explore this a little further,” or, “yeah, why don’t you go take a look and see how that might work.”

Joe Toscano: Mike, one other quick thing that is such a simple thing for leadership to do, that if somebody comes forward with something, whether it’s at the local level, the national level, the global level that makes an [00:22:00] improvement, recognize that person. And it’s important for a couple of different reasons.

One, somebody should be recognized for that effort. If they went through the trouble to try to make the company or a process or something better, they should get the recognition showing that they made an improvement that’s going to benefit hopefully everyone.

Two, it’ll encourage a lot of other people to do so. And it’s a great way to build that culture and that environment in order for people to come forward with ideas.

Mike Kent: Yeah, Joe, that recognition and acknowledgement of efforts on an individual level is so important.

And focusing more on the individuals, let’s turn our eyes towards another aspect of change kind of from the opposite point of view.

We’ve talked a lot about how people can initiate change and take their great ideas forward. What happens when you are on the receiving end of a change? Maybe you were a part of this. Maybe you weren’t a part of this. Maybe you don’t agree with the change that’s being made, but [00:23:00] oftentimes change comes to us and we have to react and respond to that.

Joe Toscano: Change, whether you were a part of it or not, again, is made for the benefit of improvement, and it’s always towards making something hopefully better, more impactful, better outcomes.

 Where people kind of fall short at times is that they see it as such a negative thing. And yes, is there a negative change that has very difficult repercussions? If you’re downsized, that’s not a positive change for you. But now you’ve been impacted in a negative manner that, you know, how do you see the rainbow there, right? How do you see that good outcome that this is going to lead to something? It’s a scary moment and people can feel that way.

Joe Toscano: But if you look at the opportunities that change creates, I could tell you, I know a lot of people that were impacted that way and ended up better than what they had been because of it. Yes, stressful time, horrible condition, worried about how they were going to land on their feet. But that drove them to use everything they had to end up [00:24:00] even better than they had been.

 Change happens. Embrace it. Always try to understand why it’s occurring. What are the benefits of it being done? How can you take full advantage of that now to maybe propel yourself even further? Change is difficult with companies when it’s made and people don’t do anything, and then it’s a failure, and they’re going to look for other ways to get to the same place. We kind of talked a little bit about that in our training episode, where, hey, if you spend a lot of money, time, energy, and you train people, but they don’t use it, then you can’t blame the training program. You got to blame the process of it being not implemented.

Same thing here. If a change happens within the organization, always recognize it’s for the better, right? It’s to improve something. But the best way to deal with it is understand it, understand the why, which is really important that that’s communicated. Understand what it should do, and then do what you need to do in order to utilize and work within that new methodology. [00:25:00] And you may be amazed at the outcomes that come.

Mike Kent: But Joe, this change means that I still have the expectations of being productive at a certain level, but now I have to learn a new system. Now I have to involve other people. Now I have to… all of these different things that I fear are going to get in the way of how I’m going to be measured as an effective employee.

Because the expectations may not have changed, but the process and me having to go through this learning curve does change. And I think that’s a real fear. I know that’s a real fear and a real aspect for people of why they resist change.

What I hear you saying is, curiosity around trying to understand why. What are the benefits of this to me? What were the reasons why changes were implemented? And how is this really going to affect me? And what are those [00:26:00] expectations of me through the learning process? I really encourage folks to ask those questions because the information that you get in the form of answers to those questions will help allay some of those fears. It may not completely turn you into a champion of that change, but at least it gives you some perspective that you can navigate that disruption, however long that is, a little easier with that better understanding.

Joe Toscano: So Mike, you bring up a great point and you’re right. When change happens, what you immediately hear is a lot of reasons why it shouldn’t happen or it can’t happen or know what it’s going to do to my current job and my performance. And unfortunately a lot of that quite frankly is excuses. That’s an “I can’t” mentality, or “I don’t want to” mentality.

What if you made just a small change in that and you said, “I can”? Yes, it’s going to be a little bit disruptive. But the idea there [00:27:00] is, that disruption and learning something new or a better process is only going to lead to a better outcome.

And let’s say the change isn’t as positive as the organization had hoped. Well, it goes back to the first part of our conversation. At least use it, implement it, find out where it could be improved. And if you find ways that you could make that change even better, bring it forward. Because again, now everybody wins. And if you found out a way to improve upon something that maybe didn’t work as expected, again, it’s an opportunity for everybody to excel and exceed.

So a very small change of attitude can lead to great outcomes.

Mike Kent: It can.

And we’ve seen, we’ve both seen it, and our teams have seen it. You go in and suggest a change and it’s proposed in the way that we talked about earlier and it begins to gather some momentum. And then, all of a sudden, people become less fearful and more accepting. And at [00:28:00] the very least, they’re able to deal with the change or the next change that comes down the pike a little easier because they’ve practiced it.

Joe Toscano: There’s there’s no magic pill. It’s like everything else. You need to start somewhere, right?

And again, there’s no negative outcome. If it’s not a good idea, at least, you know, it’s always a good starting point. What did they say? Thomas Edison failed thousands of times before he created the light bulb.

The one thing we all know, right, you miss a hundred percent of the shots you don’t take. If you’re not sharing those ideas, then you’ll never know what could have come of what your suggestions might’ve been. And it’s worth taking the shot, even if you miss.

Mike Kent: And here I think it’s important to mention that no one goes through change alone or has to go through change alone. But just to reassure folks that you have people that you trust, that you can bounce your ideas off of, that you can go to to say, “Hey, the company I work for just made this major change,” or maybe it’s a colleague, “how are you handling this?”

And there’s a lot of power and a lot of strength and a lot of confidence [00:29:00] that comes into being able to talk with people about what’s really going on for you, and get some reassurance. All of that I think is part of building that growth and resilience mindset.

We talked about acceptance and everything else of the change. But when change happens to you, it’s really important to be adaptable and flexible in your approach. And let’s be clear. We’re not talking about being the rah rah squad to change everything all the time. We’re talking about just generally being more open than you might be and more curious.

Well, as we said when we started out, we were going to attempt to take a big bite of a huge apple. And I think what we’ve done is lay a really good foundation in this initial discussion around managing change to really move forward.

Joe, for you, what were some of the most important points that people can take with them as well as leading us into [00:30:00] those future discussions on this topic?

Joe Toscano: As we started our conversation we said we really wanted to break this into two parts. You know we work within a regulated environment in the life science industry and what we wanted to do is just talk about change, in general, initially. And then in the next episode, we’re going to actually talk specifically within the regulated environment, how change needs to come about because it’s very specific. There’s a methodology there that must be followed, things that need to be implemented in order to have change occur. So we don’t want to get anybody confused from one side of this to the other.

What we really did today is just talk from a very high level in terms of how you as an individual can either foster change or be the recipient of it and make it work in a positive manner for you.

And as an initiator of change, if you have an idea, and we all do, all we’re saying is have a little bit of courage, share that with your peers, with friends, people that are supportive. You can share it with your [00:31:00] manager. If it has some merit, get some more data behind it in order to substantiate it and refine it. And then, work with your leadership in order to implement it. But good ideas usually find a life of their own, and they kind of make their way through.

If you’re on the receiving end of this, and you are a recipient of something changing, the best thing to do is to embrace it. And I know that sounds challenging and you know, “Oh, that’s just so easy to do.”

But if your first reaction is “I can’t, I won’t, and I’m not going to do this,” then you never have a chance of success with it. And the organization will also fail, because if that’s how everybody feels, they’ll never be able to get the improvement that they’re trying to initiate with it.

But if you can change your mentality to, “I can, I will”, and you implement it and put a little bit of short term effort into making it a successful outcome, two things will happen. One, there should be an improvement in the outcome of what you’ve changed and what you’ve been asked to do differently. But more importantly, [00:32:00] it opens up a tremendous opportunity that if that could even be improved on further, it gives you the chance, just like we talked about in the first step of this, in order to initiate that improvement and have those conversations. And at the end of the day, if you can take those steps, and if everybody were to do that within teams and within companies, wow, where could that lead to? And that’s where we see a lot of success.

As changes are made, as processes are implemented in order to encourage this, as people are rewarded and recognized for bringing things to an organization that has tremendous positive impact for everyone, the outcomes are 10 times better than what they had been before.

And if you’re an organization that’s not willing to do so, or listen to your employees or work within that, then you’re going to end up with a bunch of problems that are going to require some outside help in order to get those fixed. And you could avoid that very easily by doing some very small things.

So, again, complex situation, complex topic. We’re trying to [00:33:00] talk to it from, again, an extremely high level with some small things that people can do that would make big differences. And we see it all the time, which is why we chose to talk about it today. But I think everybody will be really interested in our next episode where we talk about a particular environment and a very stringent process as to how change needs to occur if you want to implement it, which is very different than what we discussed today. So, that should be a fun conversation.

Mike Kent: Absolutely, and looking forward to all of you joining us on that episode.

I want to thank you for listening to this episode of the Quality Grind Podcast. As always, we invite you to like, comment, and share wherever you’re getting your podcasts, and we’ll see you again next time here on The Grind.

Joe Toscano: If Medvacon can help you and your organization, we’re happy to do so. We specialize in the following areas: Quality and Compliance, Validation and Qualification Services, Project Management, Tech Transfers, General and Specialized Training [00:34:00] Programs, Engineering Services, and Talent Acquisition. If you have general questions as well, feel free to give us a call at any time.

We can easily be reached at 833-633-8226, or via our website at www. medvacon. com. Thanks so much, and we look forward to speaking with you.

Jessica Taylor: Thank you for listening to the Quality Grind Podcast presented by Medvacon. To learn more or to hear additional episodes, visit us at www. medvacon. com.